In this LIVE episode, we were joined by three exceptional individuals from the world of collegiate fencing: Jennie Salmon, Head Fencing Coach at Temple University; Christine Griffith, Assistant Saber Coach at the Air Force Academy; and Megumi Oishi, a sophomore Saber Fencer at Northwestern University.
Welcome to a special live episode of "First to 15," the official podcast of USA Fencing. We’re recording this live in front of an audience at the Junior Olympics in Charlotte. Today we have an exciting topic for discussion: "The Importance of Women’s Fencing — Why You Should Keep Fencing in College."
Let’s get started.
We’re joined by three exceptional individuals from the world of collegiate fencing: Jennie Salmon, Head Fencing Coach at Temple University; Christine Griffith, Assistant Saber Coach at the Air Force Academy; and Megumi Oishi, a sophomore Saber Fencer at Northwestern University. Each of these women brings a wealth of experience and insight into the world of fencing, and we can't wait to dive into this discussion.
[INTRO]
[00:00:01] BW: Hello, and welcome to First to 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing. I'm your host, Bryan Wendell, and in this show, you're going to hear from some of the most inspiring, interesting, and insanely talented people in the sport we all love. First to 15 is for anyone in the fencing community, and even for those just checking out fencing to see what it's all about. Whether you're an Olympian or a Paralympian, a newcomer, a seasoned veteran, a fencing parent, a fan, or anyone else in this wonderful community, this podcast is for you. With that, let's get to today's episode. Enjoy.
[EPISODE]
[0:00:40] BW: Thanks, everybody, for joining us. I should also say, we're recording a live episode of our podcast as well. If you miss anything today, or if someone's not here, they can tune in to First to 15th and hear this conversation. So let's move right into it. Today's topic is the importance of women's fencing, why you should keep fencing in college, and it's brought to you by USA Fencing and W Fencing.
Today we're joined by three exceptional individuals from the world of collegiate fencing. It's Jennie Salmon, who's head fencing coach at Temple University; Christine Griffith, who's the assistant sabre coach at the Air Force Academy; and then Megumi Oishi, who's a sophomore sabre fencer at Northwestern University. I'm going to try to talk as little as possible, because each of these women has a wealth of experience about fencing and collegiate fencing. So, welcome to the three of you. Thank you so much.
Jennie, we'll start with you. I'd love to hear some trends that you've noticed and observed in recruiting women high school fencers, especially maybe if something has changed over time, through your experience, and compare it to some previous seasons.
[0:01:45] JS: Well, first of all, I say hello to everyone, and thank you for being here. Clearly, we're all up here, because we are big proponents of continuing to fence and collegiate fencing. I think I would say as far as trends, technology, which is hardly new thing, but it has really influenced our ability to connect with athletes, to have outreach. No Zoom existed before COVID. But that actually opened up, such a way for us to connect with athletes throughout the nation and around the world, because we're able to not have to be face to face with them and get to know them. So that's been a great trend. The sport is growing, and to see the growth not just in athletes, but also, we have new programs popping up collegiately, so there's more access. Hopefully, that trend continues.
It's really exciting to see how USA Fencing and USFCA are using social media, really highlighting fencing, letting all of you athletes who are out there in your high school years, you're coming to these tournaments, and you're seeing right in your face all the schools that have fencing, all these opportunities that are there for you. Although we've always known it, we feel like we've always known it, I've known it the longest of the group up here. Now, you can really see, we see it on social media, and we see those highlights. So I think that that's been a great trend to promote the sport.
[0:03:02] BW: Yes, that's been something that we've emphasized that USA Fencing obviously, is shining the spotlight on collegiate fencing a lot more. Christine, kind of a similar question is, how have you seen the landscape of women's fencing evolve in college sports? What impact does this changing landscape have on recruitment for you?
[0:03:22] CG: Absolutely. One of the biggest changes I've seen since in the past two decades, since I was entering the collegiate world was, is that there's so much more access to women's fencing overall and more investment at the collegiate level in women's fencing. This has led to the recruiting environment be more competitive, particularly, we have more fencers who are interested in fencing and college. And there's particular programs, or seeing a lot of competition, and wanting to be recruited.
One of the downsides of this is, I think with the visibility of women's fencing, which has increased, which I think is great. There's also this perception of, I need to be at a certain level in order to fence in college, which isn't necessarily true. There's tons of programs out there that actually struggle to fill the rosters with enough women athletes. If you're interested in fencing in college, I think one of the critical things is to make sure you look at all the programs that are available because there's a program that will want you to be on their team.
[0:04:20] BW: Megumi, as someone who obviously made the decision to continue fencing in college, what's been your experience like at Northwestern, and maybe what doors have been open to you since you made that decision to say, "I'm going to fence collegiately at a great program"?
[0:04:34] MO: Yes, absolutely. First of all, I want to say I'm so honored to be up here with such amazing coaches. It's people like you that have helped me fence in college, so I'm really grateful for that. Honestly, what I can say from my experience is that – well, first of all, I was so very lucky, and I'm so grateful to have this opportunity to fence in college. But I will say that it is a gift that just keeps on giving. From my personal experience, I think there's been two sides of that, the interpersonal, and also kind of these opportunities that kind of come with the Division One label, or just student athlete label.
Interpersonally, I think, coming to Northwestern, I'm sure that anybody who is thinking about college or has attended college knows that college is a very scary place. It's very anxiety-inducing. For me, personally, I was thinking, am I going to be able to make friends, am I going to be able to fit in. But being on this team, there was 30 girls who are automatically willing to be my friends. I didn't really have to worry about, if I was going to be able to find friends, if I was going to fit in. I already had a space that was made for me. That really honestly alleviated a lot of anxiety in other places in my life. I always felt like I had somebody to come back to, if I had a class that I didn't like, and I was like, "Oh, is there somebody on his team who can help me out?" There was already somebody there readily available to help me.
I think, on the other side of that, in terms of having that student athlete label, that opens up a lot of opportunities. Because I've been in internships, and I've been in places where I've started to enter the corporate world. I've said, "Oh, I'm a student athlete at Northwestern." Already, people associate that with having good interpersonal skills, having good communication skills, teamwork, leadership. I think those are just some of the many benefits that I've had from being at Northwestern so far.
[0:06:32] BW: I love hearing that. Jennie, we'll go back to you. In your experience, as a coach, watching some amazing women go through your program, what unique benefits have you seen that college fencing offers to young women specifically, both in terms of personal development, and then the future opportunities once they graduate?
[0:06:50] JS: Well, I would definitely just build on what Megumi shared, because coming from her, she's currently doing it. You hear all the opportunity she has. Certainly, the team aspect is huge. You're coming in, if you're in a club environment, you have a great team, but there's nothing like truly fencing an individual bout that really matters for your team, and training together, doing everything together. That helps personal development, and trickles into every aspect of your life, being able to do something that you love. But you know, it's greater than your own accomplishment.
The discipline, the time management, all the things that are required to be a student athlete. I commend everyone here, if you're in here, and you're fencing at this tournament, you're a student athlete already. I know that you're in high school, working super hard, and getting great grades, and fencing, and training, and that continues in college. It's hard to just go to the university level and do great as a student. When you're able to go, and also do great as a student athlete, and be able to show future employers, graduate school, applications, internships, that you are accomplished academically. And you also did this other very special thing that requires a lot of discipline, commitment, it really means a lot. Megumi is experiencing it now. It puts you right at the top of the pile, because it shows that you have those capabilities, and you're still able to succeed.
I've seen that benefit, I've seen people grow. They might come in their freshman year and not have the confidence or the skills. And by the time they leave, after their fourth year, they're ready to go. So you can develop those skills. Leadership is so important. One of our core values on my team is empowerment, and making sure as women, having the opportunity to be student athletes and lead is a really special thing you get from being an athlete at the collegiate level. It's something that coaches very intentionally make sure we provide to you, whether it's through the athletic department, or other aspects of the university. It's an expectation we have of ourselves, to give to you, and it's an expectation that the team has to develop in themselves.
Those future opportunities will come. The confidence you build, and the commitment you show are going to help you in every aspect. I think that being able to walk out of a university experience as a student and an athlete, it really does open up your opportunities moving forward.
[0:09:10] BW: That's awesome. Christine, kind of building on that now, talking about the doors that college fencing opens, what have you noticed, what have you witnessed, maybe skills development, networking, and obviously, the memories that you have that you get to experience as part of one of those programs?
[0:09:25] CG: Absolutely. It's really building on what Megumi and Jen were always saying. Is it's, one, it builds you lasting connections when you go to college, and you already have a team, and you're able to bond with 17 to 30 individuals who share interests with you. Those friendships, those connections do last a lifetime beyond college. I have teammates who I went to school with, and we see each other, we’re like, "Yes." It's like we haven't had any gap of time between when we were there.
But beyond just the friendships you make, you also have an access to the community of alumni at that school who have also gone through the program, and they may be already working in the field that you're interested in. So just having the ability to network with possible mentors, or anyone who can help you advance in your career after college is huge. Then, also, I've spoken with recruit managers or recruiting fairs. One thing that's huge is they love seeing the student athletes on the resumes of their applicants, they'll go through the resumes, and they'll see that anyone who has had the experience on a team, they know that person has the self-discipline, the time management, the goal setting to want to achieve excellent results for themselves as athletes, and we'll automatically put them at the top of their lists for who they want to contact for possible positions. That's something that I think is just a huge value on being a student athlete in college.
[0:10:51] BW: Yes. When it says, not just a student athlete, but that you're a fencer. That probably stands out because it's unique, and it's a great icebreaker to for an interview. Megumi, if you were talking with someone who's in high school right now, and is a fencer, a young woman who's saying, "I'm not sure whether college fencing is right for me. Should I continue fencing when my high school career is done," what advice would you give them? How has your answer to that question really impacted your life so far?
[0:11:21] MO: Yes. I will say that, obviously, I'm really grateful that I was able to be recruited to Northwestern. But I will say that that's not the only way that you can go with college fencing. I think, like at club or just in my personal experience, I was told that that's basically the only way that you can succeed in college fencing. You have to kind of prove yourself to coaches in college, to show that you are a good fencer, or whatever that means, a good fencer, but there's other directions that you can take it. I have a friend at Brown University, who, she had stellar grades, she loved fencing, and she asked a coach for a letter of recommendation, kind of something to help propel her application a bit further. That's how she got into Brown, and she's still fencing there. Or if you don't want to kind of have that commitment, you can still fence in the club level or things like that.
It's not as black and white of a decision as it may seem. If you are a student athlete that's thinking about going to college and fencing, that's amazing. I just want to emphasize, like, I think recruitment, that big label is very scary, and it seems like a difficult thing to attain. But don't let that deter you from your dreams. There are other paths to college, and fencing in college if that's truly what you want. It's been said earlier, I think one big thing about college if there's one thing that I could really emphasize is that, it's a great way of meeting people. Like I said, there were 30 girls on my fencing team who are willing to be my friends, the second I stepped into that gym. But also, it's very cool how many people I got to meet and how many people of different backgrounds I got to be friends with.
On our team, there's people from all over the country, but also outside of the US. We've got a few international fencers. It's been great hearing about their experiences, fencing in their home countries, and connecting with them. Like Coach Griffith and Coach Salmon said, these are lifelong friendships. I'm thinking about, like, it'd be really cool if we could all meet up in 20, 30 years. And, whose weddings could I go to, or who's going to come to my wedding, things like that. It's just these things that I think are, it's such an amazing way to grow your social nexus. It's not just competing, and winning, and fighting. It's also about being on a team, and having that, really, that sisterhood that's going to stick around with you forever.
[0:13:55] BW: That's so cool. Jen, thinking about your conversations that you have with families and young fencers. If you encountered someone who was on the fence, so to speak, what would you tell them? Not just your why Temple pitch, but why college fencing in general is an important choice to make.
[0:14:12] JS: Well, I would say to them, why are you considering, what is it about the opportunity to be a collegiate athlete, to be a student athlete in fencing that intrigues you? What are you hoping for? Then, I want to listen to what they have to say. As Megumi has said, there's lots of different opportunities within NCAA fencing and then outside of NCAA fencing. Every team is different, every program has different requirements, expectations. There is a presupposed what division one versus division three is. I wouldn't even suppose that. You really need to kind of look at what your hopes and dreams are with your fencing, where you are now. Do you still have a passion? Do you want to continue for another four years? Is it something you're excited about? Are you not done?
Then, start to do your due diligence and do your research. Obviously, I highly encourage if you're on the fence, or undecided, then you should continue to look at it, and you should continue to find out great things to do, or talk to current college fencers. It's not just the coaches. You see them around the room, they love to talk about their programs, they love to talk about their experiences. I have a few fencers out there and they're excited. They've come to me and said, "Oh, people were asking me about Temple, and they love it." So absolutely talk to them, talk to athletes in your clubs, who have our former collegiate fencers, or coaches might be, or also are currently fencing. This is a really good way to get a sense of it.
Then, there's so much access, all of us have websites, get on our websites, check it out, look at our schedules, see what it is. There's live streams of almost every single collegiate meet now. So you can go and get a sense of what college fencing is, by just taking some time and looking at it. Then, start to talk to coaches, and really start to see, and you'll have good questions. How many times a week do you practice? How do you support your athletes academically, while they make this extra step in the commitment? What is the expectation of time and travel? As I said, it will be very different, and you find the one that works for you. But don't walk away from it out of an assumption of what it is, or a fear that you're not good enough. Christine said it great, there is a place for you in college fencing, whether it's at the club level, or at the varsity level. If you have a passion for the sport, you can find a place to continue.
[0:16:27] BW: Christine, kind of a similar question for you. What are those factors that, in your mind, a young woman should include when deciding whether to pursue fencing collegiately?
[0:16:36] CG: Yes. I think a huge factor is you just want to deeply consider what type of college experience you want to have. Being a student athlete is very different from being a typical college student. There's a lot more demand on your time, there's study hall requirements, there's great GPA requirements to maintain if you're on a scholarship. There is the competitive travel that we have going on, usually during the winter, usually overlaps with your midterms. So just with the amount of stress that you want to be under while you're in college. College itself is typically pretty stressful on its own, and you add athletics to it, it's a whole another layer.
Again, like Jennie was saying, talk to the coaches at the schools that you're interested in, get an idea of what is their team culture, what is the demand of that program, what's the demand of the school? So can you see yourself there and thriving as a student athlete, or looking more into the typical life of a college student? Then, looking at how important is fencing to you. Is it something that – are you trying to use fencing as a way to get into college? Are you fencing because you love the community a just love to fence? Those are the, I would say the two biggest factors, is what kind of lifestyle you want to have in college, and how important is fencing to you as a person.
[0:17:54] JS: I just want to add for the parents, understand our job as coaches is that our athletes graduate with degrees. That's the number one thing. Of course, we want to provide them the best athletic experience. But while they're making all these commitments, as well, they - we take that job very seriously. That's another thing you want to check out, because we respect and admire the commitment that they make athletically. So we give them a lot of support on the other side.
[0:18:20] BW: Megumi, when you think of your college fencing career so far, are there some specific skills or connections that you've developed? You've talked a lot about the friendships and just the atmosphere of the fencing program there. But can you expand on that a little bit about some of the things that you've experienced that you feel like if you were just a regular college student, not a student athlete, you might not have gotten able to do?
[0:18:42] MO: Right. Yes, I think – I mean, I'm just a sophomore, and I've got two more years left. So obviously, I've got a lot more growing to do at Northwestern. But I will say that there is the obvious skills that I've learned. Like, I'd say, time management. I got to do my homework, got to do my studying even when I'm traveling. I need to be able to work on a team, so teamwork. But I think one of the biggest things that I've learned in college that I didn't have in a club setting in high school was this ability to believe in my leadership.
I'm kind of an introverted person, and I am pretty – I think I hold back from finding spaces for leadership. I kind of hold back and I'm like, "Oh, I'll just let somebody else take care of it. I'll just follow what they say," in high school. I think there's this big, I don't know how many of you are club fencers right now. But I feel like there is that culture of, "Oh, I'll just look up to the juniors and seniors in my club. I'm just a freshman. I'm just an eighth grader, I'll just kind of hang back and let them do the work."
But in college at Northwestern, I have been told that you don't have to be a junior, senior to have those leadership positions. You could be a freshman, and think, "Mm, this could be something that I can improve or help my team improve on." So you can speak up in these spaces, and people will actually encourage it very much. I think what's really cool is that in, or at least at Northwestern, there's three weapons; sabre, épée, and foil. Within those squads, there's like, I want to say, eight to 10 girls. In those spaces, it's super easy to be a leader, because it's not this huge 30-person team that you have to raise your hand and be like, "Mm, I have an idea." You can be a leader in a smaller space. That will help you fuel your confidence, and build your leadership skills.
I think that's what's really huge about college fencing is that it's really imperative for growing minds that you kind of understand, and observe the impacts that your leadership has. Because I think it's so easy, I think in in this big college space, academically, to kind of have your voice be lost. Because there's so many people in a college, that's just the reality of it. But when you're in a space that is smaller, a little bit more secluded, and people are there to empower, and encourage your growth. I think that's just a great way to build your courage and to build your own leadership skills for whatever you may want to apply that to internships, your career, future advocacy, things like that.
I just want to say that it was an amazing choice for me to fence in college, because going to Northwestern, I was able to meet my coach, Dennis. He's over there right now. He's amazing. It's because of him that I've kind of gained this confidence to speak on panels like this. As I said, I'm a very introverted person. But once I spoke to Dennis about all the things that I like to work on, like advocacy, and fighting for women, and LGBTQ plus rights, he said, "Well, being on panels, and using your voice like this is crucial and it's needed in a community like this." I'm just really grateful, and happy that I chose to fence in college, because I have those connections and people that will support me for the rest of my life.
[0:22:13] BW: That's well said. I have a ton more questions, but I also wanted to open up to the audience, if anybody has any questions. Michael is going to be coming around with a microphone, and just a reminder that the topic of this conversation is, women's fencing specifically. That type of question would be best suited for this panel, and then recruiting type questions will be at other panels later on this evening. If anybody has one, raise your hand, or else, I can – okay. Well, people are thinking, I've got one for the group. It comes on something that Christine, you said earlier, which is about culture and asking questions about culture. How does one assess the culture at a program? This could be for all three of you, or any of you. How do you really assess that? Because you can't really tell by looking at a website, or social media, and even conversations. Obviously, the fencer or the coach is going to paint a pretty rosy picture, I would imagine. How do you get that genuine feel for what the culture might be like?
[0:23:04] CG: Yes. One of the biggest things you can do is, is contact the coaches of the program. Coaches are happy to talk to you, they want to talk to you, they want to hear from prospective student athletes. Just start by asking questions. In another way, if the school really interests you, and you have that first conversation with the coach, when you are pursued further, ask if you can come do a campus visit, you can do unofficial, and official visits. A lot of times on those visits, you can go and see part of practice, you can chat with the team members, and talk with them. Because you're going to get certain picture from the coach, but then, you can get another picture from the student athletes who were there on the program. And getting that sense for, how do they interact with each other, what is the demand of that particular program, and what is practice like. Are they all friends with each other? Are they competitive with each other? Just simply reaching out and talking to both student athletes and to the coaches is one the best ways to find out about that team culture.
[0:23:57] JS: I would agree that as you go through your search, and you find schools you're very interested in, visiting is key. One, the vibe, the feel you get means something, and it's for the team. It's also the university itself, right? This is a place you're going to be learning for four years. One question that some athletes will ask me is, what's your coaching philosophy? I think that that's a way to get a good glimpse into how that coach would build a culture around the philosophy of how they develop athletes and how they see the team experience as they take responsibility for creating it for their program.
[0:24:31] BW: Another question, unless there's one from the audience. Please raise your hand. Oh, please. Sorry.
[0:24:36] Female Speake: First, I want to say, thank you so much. All three of you are amazing, and we are so grateful you are here today. This question is for Megumi, but also for Jennie, and for Christine, because I know you were college fencers, and you're working with college fencers. How has being a college fencer fed your fire to keep fencing beyond college?
[0:24:56] MO: Right. One of the biggest things about fencing in college is that, yes, it is an extension of high school fencing, but in a totally different space, right? In high school, you kind of started by your teammates, you're kind of like in a team, but not really, you're kind of fencing individually. But in college, it's really again, as I emphasized, it's a team. That's a big transition. I think that's a transition that requires confidence, and stepping out of your comfort zone.
I think, had I not gone to college and fence, I would have had trouble extending my high school fencing experience into a kind of post-high school, post-competitive space of fencing. I think, because I've been fencing in college, I'm more open to the idea of fencing after college, whether that be 20, 30 years down the line of fence veterans. One thing that some of you may know is that my mom, Yoko Oishi is a veteran 50 women's saberist. It's really inspiring to watch her fence, and try out the sport, and really see that fencing really is for everybody, for all ages.
I think that is something, I think, a really unique perspective that I'm able to have because of my mom, that I can continue fencing after college. It's not just something that ends right after I turned 22, and I graduate in the summer of 2026. It's not like I'm retired, I'm done, I'm finished with this sport. It's honestly a community and a culture that I will never be able to let go of. I think, college fencing and fencing here has been a really good way to really kind of show to myself that I can go through that transition, and I can fence in different spaces, and not just in high school.
[0:26:45] BW: Yes. So you heard it here, Megumi is going for that vet world championship in 30 years. What would that be? Yes, that's awesome. For any of you, it occurs to me, and when I've talked to some high school fencers, they've shared this as well. It's very difficult to assess like whether you're good enough to fence in college. And really, the only way for a fencer to compare herself to another fencer is through rankings, point systems, and results. How do you translate those results into, whether there's going to be a spot for me at the collegiate level? What's your advice there?
[0:27:20] JS: I mean, I think it's fine to directly ask that question of a coach when you speak to them. You know you're coming in next, it will be fall of 2024. What are your availabilities, openings in this weapon that year? Because some of it has nothing to do with, whether you're a strong fencer or not. It's whether that team is graduating or has – and it ebbs and flows. Some of it is opportunity that's just going to come your way. It's a good question to ask.
Coaches aren't just looking at, yes, depending on the program, your fencing skill is very important. But also, what kind of sports person are you when you're on the strip? How do you behave not just in victory, and in loss. They want to hear from you why you want to fence in college, how much team means to you, and how you're anticipating that experience different from a club time, or competing for yourself, whether it's nationally or internationally. I think being very forward with what you're hoping for, and if there's a space for you, and then knowing that coaches aren't just looking at always exactly, whether you're an A-rated fencer who's ranked the very top of the country versus someone with great potential, who shows great sportsmanship, great heart, great fight, and they still have a passion to continue to grow. That can sometimes be even more attractive to the collegiate coach who's building a program.
[0:28:38] CG: Yes. I would just add on to that, as it goes back to as you're considering whether you want to fence in college, and you don't know if you're good enough. There isn't really a one set standard of what is good enough defense in college. Every program is a little bit different. Every coach who runs their program, they're looking for a variety of different things. On each team, there's different roles that the coaches want to fil. We do want athletes with skill, we do want athletes who are going to be the glue to the team, are going to really hype their teammates up and support. We also want athletes who are going to be leaders on that team. Sometimes, all of those elements come into one fencer, sometimes it's filled by different fencers. But the biggest thing is, is you got to contact the coaches, and ask, what spots do you have open for, fall 25 or fall 26? Then, ask like, what is it that they're looking for in those spots they want to fill?
[0:29:26] MO: I will say that I've kind of – I totally agree that you really do have to contact coaches, and you really do have to show that I think commitment, and this want for what your dream is. Because I've seen, I think in my high school years, I've seen both sides of it. I've seen people who definitely have the hard numbers and stats to be able to fence in college and get recruited, but they just didn't like reach out to anybody. They fell short of what their dreams actually were. But then, I also saw people who were not exactly on the national rankings, but they showed that fight, and they showed that tenacity. That was what some coaches were looking for, and so they ended up getting recruited to those colleges.
I will say to anybody who is thinking about fencing in college, like my number one advice as somebody who went through the process as well is to reach out. Show that fight and show that want. I think, for a lot of the colleges, and especially the ones that I think you would want to go to, and really feel wanted, and to fit in, I think that is what coaches are looking for, for that fight and that want.
[0:30:37] BW: Another question from the audience, please?
[0:30:38] Male Speaker: Hi. In the beginning of the lecture, you said that they were struggling to fill some of the girl's spots? Have you identified why or what are those obstacles?
[0:30:49] CG: A lot of times we find that there are fencers who will just discount themselves out as not qualified to compete in college. I don't think that they hit a high enough level. Part of it is, when we see the visibility of women's fencing at the college level, we typically are going to see the top 10 schools. The fencers going there are fencing internationally, or they're A ranked, or they have national points. I think it's very easy for a young woman to get the idea like, "Well, I don't have an A. I'm probably not good enough to get recruited" or "I can't get scholarships, and I shouldn't fence in college." When there are a bunch of schools that would gladly take any fencers who have even a limited amount of experience, and have them on the team. I think a lot of times, women will be like, "Well, I'm just not good enough to fence," when they haven't fully explored all of the options, all the variety of ways you can fence in college, both at the varsity and club level.
[0:31:40] JS: Yes, I would agree. It's a combination of assumptions, and a bit of misinformation. Because again, you just need to look, and see, and find out, and maybe you find a program isn't the right one for you, and that's okay too. That's part of the process. Hopefully, I think this type of thing, hopefully will go a long way to alleviate that. All of you who are here, you can help spread the word for us, that would be great.
[0:32:02] BW: Another one from the audience, please.
[0:32:04] Female Speaker: I want to ask if the case interested in continuing the fencing in college. If we say, they are recruited, they're pretty likely to get recruited. With a female, they don't get recruited, what will be the process we can still get into – first, if at least can still get into the college team to continue fencing? Or second, if yes, what will be the process to continue?
[0:32:29] JS: I'm not sure if everyone's process at times, people will be in that situation, and they love the school, they just love the school. It's where they want to learn, and it's where they're going to land. They would reach out to the program and ask if there's a possibility for them to come on as a walk on. That's one way. That's again, it's going to be program-specific. It's also going to depend on the year, and the spacing, and who's graduating, or not. We also have – a lot of schools will have a varsity program and a club program. So they will have the opportunity to come and fence in the club program. I know it happens at times at the university level that athletes can transition from club to varsity. Again, depending on the situation. It's very situation dependent, and program dependent.
But if you love fencing, and you know there's fencing at a school you weren't recruited to, reach out to the coach, and ask them if there's opportunity.
[0:33:18] CG: If I can just add on to that, I think an important thing too is, in students' junior year, make sure you reach out to the coaches. Don't wait for a coach to recruit your particular fencer. Because we only see a certain number of athletes at a NAC, or regional competition. So part of starting that recruitment process, and that conversation is to reach out to the coaches initially and then starting that conversation. If at that point, they cannot recruit that fencer, then later, you only talk about, the walk-on process for various schools, But don't be afraid to reach out to those coaches, and start that process.
[0:33:52] BW: Any other questions? Okay. I'll end with a fun one that I have, which is for people who have only experienced fencing at like a NAC, or a Junior Olympics, how do you describe the atmosphere of a college meet? What is it like actually going in fencing, wearing your school's colors, and getting out there and fencing? This is for any or all of you.
[0:34:11] JS: I'm getting chills. It's fantastic. It's amazing. There's nothing like it. I mean, of course, when you're fencing at a NAC, in a DE, and your teammates are cheering for you. That's an amazing experience too. But there's nothing like being on the strip, having your whole team there cheering for you. Win or lose, they have your back, they know what you're going through, they know how hard it is to be out there. Building that sense of, just love for each other, and the experience, and supporting each other, victories are great and we want to have them all the time. But it's a lot of times, in those tough moments, when you lay it all out on the strip, and it doesn't go your way, and you have your whole team behind you lifting you, there's just nothing like it. I think, if you come to a collegiate meet, you're going to see that all around the room from every team such great sportsmanship, such excitement for the experience and the sport that we all love.
[0:35:04] CG: College fencing is so much fun, and it's loud. If you think about –
[0:35:09] JC: It's true.
[0:35:09] CG: When you're competing, you might have a few teammates cheering you on, along with your coaches, maybe a few family members. At a college level, think about tripling, or quadrupling it. Both Coach Salmon and I were at Duke last weekend with our teams. The energy in the room for every single match was so intense and so loud. The way it was organized, we typically have like one bout going at the end, if teams were tied up. Both teams, as soon as a call was – or a touch was made, both teams are screaming, and yelling, and like, "Ah, it was ours." Just the energy is unbelievable, and so much fun.
[0:35:47] MO: Absolutely. I think that just as somebody who dreamed of Northwestern like my entire life, stepping into a college meet, of course, was daunting. But it was also honestly such an honor and pleasure to represent my school. I was so proud to be able to fence and represent my school, and my university, and my squad, my team. It really, as the coaches said, it's honestly just such a different vibe, and it's so much fun. My dad has been – he has watched me fence at the Northwestern home duels for the past two years now. This time, after I fence, and everything was done, he came up to me, and he was like, "This is an experience that you will cherish forever, and this is something that not everyone can experience. This is something that you will remember. You're not going to remember which school you won against this time, which school you lost against. This is what you're going to remember. You're going to remember being with your teammates, being with your squad mates, and having fun, and feeling like you are part of a community, and that community is going to last forever."
Those are words that I'm going to remember for the rest of my college career and beyond. It's honestly such an amazing opportunity, and just this amazing fire, and love for each other, and the sport that I don't think you can find anywhere else. Honestly, if you are on the fence, about college fencing, that is also a big thing that you could be excited for it. It's an amazing opportunity that you wouldn't be able to find at JO's or a NAC, or anything. It's really unique to college fencing and I'm grateful to be a part of it.
[0:37:24] BW: That's well said, and that's a great place to leave it. So thank you to everyone for joining, and those listening to the podcast, and especially our panelists. Let's give them round of applause, please?
[0:37:33] MO: Thank you.
[0:37:39] BW: Thanks, y'all. We've got a great program continuing today. I think Michael is going to put the slide up with the other sessions right. So hope you can come back and check out another one. Thanks, y'all.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[0:37:47] BW: Thanks for listening to First to 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing. We'll be back with our next conversation in a couple of weeks. In the meantime, you can stay up to date on all the latest fencing news by following us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. If you liked this podcast, please help us grow and reach more people by leaving us a rating or review. Until next time, I'm Bryan Wendell, and I hope to see you real soon out on the Strip. Bye.
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