Our guest is Georgina Love, a foil and epee veteran fencer from Central Florida.
In this episode of First to 15, we're joined by Georgina Love, a foil and epee fencer from Central Florida. Georgina, who is fondly known as George, recently showcased her tenacity at the North American Cup in St. Louis in April 2023, where she won gold medals in both the Vet-60 Women's Foil and the Vet-60 Women's Epee events. In a thrilling final foil bout, George turned an early 5-0 deficit into a 10-9 victory, triumphing over the reigning World Champion.
George's journey to the pinnacle of the fencing world has been anything but conventional. Her passion for the sport was ignited in 2001 when she discovered a local rec center fencing class in Fort Pierce, Florida. For seven years, she honed her skills there until the program was shuttered. However, her dedication to the sport remained unscathed, and she kept pushing her boundaries, competing in tournaments and embracing the thrill of competition.
In 2015, she took over her local fencing club, ensuring the survival of the sport in her area, and around seven years ago, she began training with Coach Daniel Bucur in Melbourne, Florida. This partnership has led her to new heights in the fencing world, deepening her understanding and enjoyment of the sport.
Apart from being a fencer, George is a woman of many talents. She's an oil painter who teaches classes, a horse rider, and a museum worker who installs exhibits. In this episode, we're going to delve into the multifaceted life and career of this extraordinary fencer.
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First to 15: The Official Podcast of USA Fencing
Host: Bryan Wendell
Cover art: Manna Creations
Theme music: Brian Sanyshyn
EPISODE 28
[INTRODUCTION]
[0:00:02] BW: Hello, and welcome to First to 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing. I'm your host Bryan Wendell. In this show, you're going to hear from some of the most inspiring, interesting, and insanely talented people in this sport we all love. First to 15 is for anyone in the fencing community, and even for those just checking out fencing to see what it's all about. Whether you're an Olympian, or Paralympian, a newcomer, a seasoned veteran, a fencing parent, a fan, or anyone else in this wonderful community, this podcast is for you. With that, let's get to today's episode. Enjoy.
[INTERVIEW]
[0:00:40] BW: Today's guest is Georgina Love, a Foil and Épée fencer from Central Florida. Georgina, who's fondly known as George, recently showcased her tenacity at the North American Cup in St. Louis in April, where she won gold medals in both the Vet 60 Women's Foil and the Vet 60 Women's Épée events. In that final foil bout, she was down 5-0, and then turned that into a 10-9 victory over the reigning world champion.
Now, Georgia's journey to the pinnacle of fencing has been anything but conventional. Her passion for the sport was ignited in 2001, when she discovered a local rec center fencing class in Florida. For seven years, she honed her skills there until that program was closed, but her dedication to the sport remained unscathed. She kept pushing her boundaries, competing in tournaments, loving every minute. Then in 2015, she took over her local fencing club, which helped ensure the survival of the sport in her area. She began training with Coach Daniel Bucur in Melbourne, Florida. Now, this partnership has led her to new heights in the fencing world. We're excited to chat about that.
Of course, apart from being a skilled fencer, George is a woman of many talents, an oil painter, horse rider, museum worker who installs exhibits. There's a lot to talk about. We're going to dive into all that and more with George. Welcome to the podcast.
[0:01:58] GL: Good morning. Thank you. I'm thrilled to be here and really appreciate you taking the time to do an interview.
[0:02:03] BW: Yeah, this is exciting. Well, and there's a lot of ground to cover as has hinted up by that intro. But I'm really interested in that initial exposure to fencing in 2001. You saw an ad for fencing. What made you say, “Okay, point at that. I'm going to try that”?
[0:02:20] GL: Well, the funny thing is, is all my life, I have had this knowledge that fencing existed. That was about it. I'd never seen movies. I didn't play with swords. I didn't do any of that. I just knew it was there. I remember, actually, going to school in New York and walking by a fencing club looking in the window thinking, “Oh, look. Fencing. That's cool.” I never did anything about it. I saw the ad for the rec center and I said to my husband, “You know, I've always wanted to do that.” He said, “Well, go do it.”
I took a lesson and I am the least athletically coordinated person in the world. I took this first lesson, but I really liked the instructor. He was an épée fencer and he had competed earlier on and he was doing these Foil lessons at the local rec center to keep his finger and his kids had fenced, he'd competed, that sort of thing. I did my first lesson and I don't know what I was doing, but I loved it and I liked him and I kept going week after week after week. I had no idea what I was doing, but it was seven years of torturing this poor man. It was my incompetence. It was really a hot mess.
We didn't compete. We didn't do anything, really. We just had two and a half to three hours of footwork and hand drills and that sort of thing. I loved it. He said, “You're never really going to get anything out of it, unless you compete.” Okay. As you said earlier, the program ended and I thought, “Yeah. Who needs it?” But I missed it, so I joined the local club and just carried on there. There was just something about it that partly, it was the discipline. Even though I didn't know what I was doing, I liked the discipline of it and I enjoyed the people.
Then I did my first competition. It was a little exhibition. We did a dry tournament down in Fort Lauderdale. A bunch of us from the club went down and that first day I competed there, I thought, I like this competition part. That was it. After that, I started going to local competitions here in Florida. The odd thing was that I showed horses and I had some success, but no consistency and nerves got in the way, and I had problems with the horse showing part. We were showing on cattle and it was just – it was rough.
With fencing for some reason, it felt just better. I was just more at ease and I felt like you were instantly part of the group, which I really liked. I felt that no matter what silly thing you did out there, that people were laughing at you or whatever, because you sure learned to laugh at yourself when you fenced, too. I always felt like you were instantly part of the community, which I really liked. I really enjoyed the people part of it, too.
[0:04:52] BW: I find that interesting, the length of time between that first class and your first tournament. Obviously, you were doing some sparring, I imagine, some practice bouts in there. I just loved the thought that this whole time your skills were building and building and building. Was there never an urge to say, “You know what? I keep hearing about these regional tournaments, these NACs, I'm going to go try that.”
[0:05:14] GL: No. I was clueless. I had no idea. I had no idea, because really, my skills weren't that good. I just went through them. I mean, I'm telling you, I really struggled with it and it didn't come easily to me. I never knew about competition. I didn't even think about it. That first little exhibition one, like I say, was a lot of fun. My instructor at that time that was at the second club, my coach said, “Oh, there's one in Miami this fall. You should go.” I said, “Okay.” I bought all my electric stuff and I went.
It was one of those ignorance is bliss things, because I went and I remember, I did the women's, I did the D and under. I think I finished fifth that day in the D and under with 22 people. I had no idea what I was doing. It just worked out, but I really liked it. It was just so much fun. I didn't even have my weapon taped right, as a matter of fact. Ann Marie Walters was there. It's the first time I had met her. She's a reigning world champion actually, just so you have that right.
[0:06:13] BW: Oh, yes.
[0:06:13] GL: Yeah. She was there and she said, “You got to tape that weapon.” Didn't you have tape on my weapon?
[0:06:20] BW: You're like, “Okay, that's good to know for the future.”
[0:06:23] GL: Yeah. I'm telling you, it was just plopped in from outer space.
[0:06:28] BW: For people who may not know this world, when you say like a dry tournament, a non-electric, that one in 2009, what exactly does that mean?
[0:06:37] GL: In 2009, we were invited by Hollywood Saber down in Fort Lauderdale to come and fence and show people a Foil tournament. None of us had electric gear, really, because for that, because our club wasn't competing at that time. Nobody was going to competitions. We just went down there with no electric and we just did a non-electric little demonstration tournament. But we went through the whole thing, did the pools, did the DEs, the whole thing. It was just dry, not electric.
The next tournament I went to, which that was, I think, in July, the next tournament, the real tournament that I went to was that fall where obviously, it was a proper sanctioned tournament, so you had to have all your goodies. I just had to get everything and go.
[0:07:15] BW: When you started competing and going to more and more tournaments, did you find yourself in the minority, in the sense that you started fencing in your early 40s, if my math is correct? Whereas, some of the other competitors maybe had fenced as kids and then taken a break and come back into the sport?
[0:07:32] GL: Well, that was only after I did my first veteran event. I can't remember when that was. I'd have to look it up. I was fencing locally. Of course, at 42, I'm fencing teenagers and young adults. It was right. It was just local. I had no idea what I was going to go up against with the vets. I was at a tournament in Orlando and Mary Mahone, the local regional, and I think she's a national, international director from here in Florida, she came up to me and said, “Oh, you should do the vet circuit.” I said, “Sure. That sounds like a good idea.” I was in my 50s then.
I remember telling my husband and he said, “Are you out of your mind?” He said, “Those people are experienced and this and that.” That's when I realized when I first started going, I'd look at these lists of 25, 26 women and I'm thinking, “I should do okay.” Well, no. They were former NCAA people and Olympians and almost Olympians and national team members. I had no idea that that's what I was going to be fencing. There are some other women who started late, but I just didn't know what I was going to jump into. I had a blast there with it. I just showed up and fenced and tried to have a good time.
[0:08:43] BW: How about the community aspect, too? Because that's the element of that fencing, that the competition is fierce. When those masks go on, it's go time for sure. When they come off, I just am always struck by, it's like a community. Were you welcomed into that community pretty much right away?
[0:09:02] GL: Yes. I will say, I was. I had really good memories of Anne Marie Walters again, I'll say, because she's a local life fencer here every once in a while and we see each other in South Florida. Of course, I didn't like going a 1,000 miles and having to see her at the table of 16, but that's another story. I remember very well my very first – the very first summer nationals I qualified for. As a matter of fact, I went to a qualifier here in Florida and there were 11 women. It was a nice, strong event. I lost in the semi-final and I thought I was out. They were only going to take the top three people. They said, “No, no. You have to fence off for third place.” I thought, “Oh. Well, I want this,” and I won. I was able to go to the nationals.
I remember very good memories of Anne Marie taking me around and introducing me to people saying, “This is George. This is her first time here. She's going to come do the events now.” Yeah, it was immediate welcome.
[0:09:55] BW: That's awesome.
[0:09:56] GL: Yeah. Everybody's not everybody's best friend and that's fine. We all make our friends. It's an interesting dynamic. What I find fascinating is how, like you say, the masks are on, it’s fierce competition, yet, we're all rooming together. We're helping each other out. I see the vets, somebody just took you out. But then that loser of that event is sitting there in the coaching box, helping the guy who just beat him beat the other fellow. I love that. I think it's really great.
[0:10:22] BW: Every time you come back to one of these tournaments, it may have been a few months since you've seen some of the competitors. I imagine you can just dive right back in as if no time had passed.
[0:10:33] GL: You do. It's really incredible. Even after this COVID chasm, where we didn't see each other for a long time. It was just like, time had never stopped. I really enjoy that part of it, because again, we're all not close and intimate friends, but there's a really nice camaraderie with everybody. It's so nice seeing the familiar faces and especially when you go overseas and all that and hear the people you fence at home and now you're at another venue and you're on another side of the world.
[0:11:00] BW: Yeah, exactly. It opens so many doors. Looking back on April with your double gold, obviously, that's proof that your fencing story is still being written. I'm wondering if you have a proudest moment so far in your competition career.
[0:11:16] GL: Well, I would say that one of the most exciting and proud things was my very first time going to the world championships. I qualified in 2016 for that season and we went to Germany. I was frankly, just overwhelmed by the whole thing. It was so exciting. Then I remember sitting there looking at all these brackets and thinking, “Wow, this is just – What am I doing here with all these people?”
Anyway, I did well enough in the individual event to make the team event. I was ecstatic. In the interim, however, I had tripped and fallen outside the venue and hurt my left shoulder pretty badly, where the doctor there was saying things about X-rays. I said, “No, no, no, no. We're good. I'm just going to put some ice on it.” The following day we had to fence team. My shoulder was killing me, but I was not scratching. I made it this far. I was not going to scratch. I could barely move my arm.
We had to fence the Hungarians and we had to fence the Russians. Well, my very first international event, my very first bout is with the gold medalist from the individual event, [inaudible 0:12:22] from Russia. I'm thinking, “Wow.” My team captain said, “Go in there and don't engage. Do what you have to do.” Well, the time goes on and to be honest with you, my teammates had seen me do plenty of not-good fencing along these past few years. I'm sure that they did not have any confidence and thought, “How are we going to get ourselves out of this hole?” When the three minutes were up, I had beaten her 5-1 in the first encounter.
Ultimately, through all the encounters we had, I was able to keep her out and at bay, which allowed us to get to the finals with the French, where we took the silver medal. I was very happy to not have let my team down and done what I needed to do to get us to the finals and the ultimate goal there was to get there and do that. I felt great about not letting my team down. I think, it was so funny, because then they changed the tune, because then I could do no wrong. They were happy with everything I did.
Also, I remember the Russian side just being so frustrated that somehow, they just couldn't get past me. I don't know how it happened. I remember picking my arm up saying, well, when you get on the strip, the pain is my shoulder hurt so much. I just said, that willpower and adrenaline, let's do it.
[0:13:36] BW: Right. Maybe not what your doctor would have recommended in that moment. But obviously, it worked out.
[0:13:40] GL: No. However, I did realize that they're always telling you to relax your shoulders when you fence. Since I couldn't use my shoulder, I think I fenced much better. I think that's what helped me.
[0:13:50] BW: It’s a disguised blessing there.
[0:13:53] GL: Yes, it was.
[0:13:53] BW: George, before that tournament, did you have a sense of the scale of vet fencing at the international level? Because that would have been your first exposure to it, right?
[0:14:02] GL: Yes. I remember clearly sitting on the bench, looking at the brackets up on the board, going Italy, Germany, Hungary, Russia. Oh, my God. I was overwhelmed.
[0:14:12] BW: I think that's really interesting. The fact that there is an international community of vet fencers as well. You may not see them as often, but that's, again, it's not as if you’re bitter rivals with every single country that you face, right? I imagine, there's some friendships that are formed across borders, so to speak.
[0:14:31] GL: Right. I think that mutual respect and all that. I'll remember another fond memory I have of that event is when I was leaving, [inaudible 0:14:39] was on the other side of the gate there and she made a particular effort to, as I was going to catch my eye, look at me, wave and shook my hand. That was a great bout. Getting that respect from somebody is also a nice thing.
[0:14:53] BW: Yeah, that's true. It's like, at first, they might have said, “Who is this woman? We got her.” Then they quickly realized, they maybe didn't. I love that story.
[0:15:02] GL: Yeah, it was one of my favorite times. Like I say, I was really happy to keep the team where it needed to be, to do my part. You want to be on a team and you want to do your part.
[0:15:10] BW: Yeah, there's that added pressure when it's not just yourself that you're potentially letting down if something goes wrong out there. We talked in the intro about taking over your local fencing club in 2015. Can you tell us more about that journey? Because now all of a sudden, you're also the proprietor of a fencing club and helping introduce other people to the sport.
[0:15:34] GL: Right. That was a little bit of a surprise. My coach who had run that club, he just loved fencing. He fenced in college. He was a saber fencer for. He just loved the sport. He wanted everybody to fence. He'd had the club at that point for, I think, about six or seven years if I'm not wrong. It might have been longer. I was going to his club three, four times a week and we had a nice bunch of youth and I was probably the oldest fencer. It was mostly youngsters.
Anyways, he died suddenly in January of 2015. I thought, “What are we going to do?” Then I decided, well, I'm just going to take over the club, because if I don't do that, we won't have any fencing here. We struggled around a little bit and we stayed in the place that we were in, but I ultimately, had to move and find another club. Now, it's basically carrying on what he started. I don't forget that either, because he always believed in me as well. We try to keep his memory alive.
I have a scholarship that I give to the kids at the end of the school year. There's somebody who's graduating and has done, say, volunteered at the club, helping with camp, been coming, improved a lot, been a real champion of the club, so to speak. I like to give them a little cash scholarship in Ken's memory and try to keep that alive. Basically, it's just keeping his legacy alive. But turning that into, I can't just have the doors open and have a free for all. I've actually got to teach these kids something.
We take them and start them all off. It is just, I understand now why my coach liked to – he coached more than he fenced. I always said, “Don't you miss fencing? Don't you want to fence?” He'd play with us here and there. He went to a couple of NACs, but he really enjoyed the coaching part of it. Now that I do it, and I don't really call myself a coach. I'm an instructor and the club owner, but I want to teach these kids. But there's a great deal of satisfaction when I see these kids improving, just getting a grip of what they're doing. Taking some kids, maybe who are shy, who when they put that mask on, they go for it. They have a total change in personality.
I hear from the parents that they're improved in school. They're improved in focus. It is all around extremely satisfying. Because I think anybody who runs a club, or a small business like that knows that the paycheck is definitely not there. It's not a paying job, but the payback is helping these kids to fence and realize that this activity is good for them all around. It teaches them a lot and watching them succeed and having excitement when they get something done on the strip is really, that's the pay. That's great.
[0:18:09] BW: Especially, to think that the club might have closed, right, without some intervention?
[0:18:13] GL: It would have closed. Nobody was there to take it over. Nobody, recently, in the position. Fortunately, I was only working part time and it just worked out. I mean, I'm down there three days a week, no matter what. It's ongoing classes and knock on wood, I don't catch a cold or anything like that, because we just have to keep on going.
At the time when my coach was right at the club, we had some youngsters competing. But right now, we don't have that many people. We don't have anybody really competing. It's mostly younger and young teens, but very satisfying. I really enjoy it. We try to have little tournaments. I'm having one this Saturdays, as a matter of fact, for the kids to come and bow. It's nice to see their competitive juices get going, because everybody wants that medal.
[0:18:55] BW: Sure. Yeah. It keeps it interesting and keeps it fresh. How does that balance out with your own fencing and being able to find time to practice with your own coach?
[0:19:05] GL: It's really hard. That's why sometimes I have to say, I have to remind myself, I'm pleased with my results, even at the onset when things aren't going totally my way. I was pleased with what I could accomplish to some extent, because of the time I have, which is very limited. I go for my lessons once a week. I have to drive an hour to get to Coach Bucur's place. He's up in Melbourne. I have some push at club, but not as much. I mean, I'm not in a club like Fencer's Club, or something or Bluegrass where you've got a huge cadre of high-level people to fence with. I don't have that.
I have the kids I have to instruct. Then you have the church from instructor mode to fencer mode, which isn't easy. I have a couple of vet fencers who were good and give me a little push. It's pretty hard. I mean, I've got to be hitting the pad, or doing that sort of thing. I don't have as much quality fencing time to work on my skills as I wish I did.
I'm just going to say, but that said, I have to say that you become who you are because of every single person you've encountered. I take that with the nine-year-olds I teach up to the champions I fence at NAC. Every single person has made me who I am and along the way. I don't discount any of it either.
[0:20:21] BW: Sure. Yeah. You're building on every experience along the way. How is it working with Coach Bucur and how has he maybe elevated your game over your time working together?
[0:20:34] GL: Well, he's helped me immensely. In 2015, before I won that gold in Baltimore, I had been struggling with my fencing in that I realized I was just – having fun is fine. It isn't only about winning as we know, because you don't win all the time. I felt like I could not give my opponents a challenge. That really bothered me. It bothered me that I would get on the strip. If I won, I won. If I lost, I lost. I had no idea what was going on.
Worse than that, I wouldn't challenge my opponent. I didn't know how. I realized, I needed help and Coach Bucur was really the closest one to me, also. I couldn't go to Miami or Orlando. I just couldn't. He was in Melbourne and I asked him if he would take me on. He agreed. That time his club was called Genesis. He'd been there at that point for about five or six years up in Melbourne.
I started with him. He, of course, has a very good history. He was poised to go on the Olympic team. He was a high-level junior fencer in Romania. Very skilled. He knew his business. Well, I started with him and it was really hard at the beginning, because I had to break some habits. I had to force myself to not do what I had been doing. It was difficult. However, he over the years, he just knew what I needed all the time and would keep me going and feeding me the information as I needed it. Most importantly, teaching me about strategy and tactics, where I had none.
Not only were my skills lacking, because I didn't have the fundamentals that somebody who starts when they’re 10 and then fences through high school and college and does all of that have. I had nothing to fall back on. I just had what I was doing and staying alive with. I had success here in Florida. At that point, I had been doing the NACs, but just, I was always a bridesmaid. I couldn't break into eight. I just couldn't do it. I'd be 10th, 11th, 9th. It was just so frustrating.
After I learned about what to do and when to do it and hone my skills and got a little more educated about what was going, he was really very, very forthcoming with his knowledge, which has been fantastic. Now it's Space Coast Fencing and that's what his club is known now. He's just expanded my horizons in decision making and strategies, where sometimes maybe physically I can't do what I need, but mentally, I can. That has been just enormous for me, enormous that at least, I can make a decision and well, if I lost, then I knew why. Perhaps, it wasn't the right decision, or perhaps I didn't execute it properly. Instead of standing there going, “Well, I lost. Too bad.” I've got much more to think about that way. I have him to thank for teaching me how to fence.
[0:23:25] BW: In a sense, I would imagine that that relationship with your coach requires a bit of patience in the sense that when you do feel like you have a new skill that you want to try, you've got to wait to actually experience the next tournament to be able to test some of these things. Is that an accurate way to say it? It seems you're like, “I want to try this right this weekend.”
[0:23:47] GL: Absolutely. Well, you do. You learn it. Again, seriously, I told him at the onset, I said, I really struggle with drills. I struggle with patterns. I struggle with certain things. It's not easy for me. I need a lot of repetition. We do these things and he would tell me too. He says, “You have to be patient.” In fact, when I started with him, he said, it was November of 2015. He said, “You're going to have to be patient.” He says, “You're not going to see any results for months.” Okay. I said, “You know what? I haven't had results for nine years. Do you think a few months is going to bother me? It's not.”
[0:24:21] BW: It's a good answer.
[0:24:22] GL: It's true, because you learn a move. Immediately, I try to keep it in my head and my next session at my club is Wednesday night where I have adults and I say, “Okay, okay. I've got to try whatever he showed me.” Then I've got to apply it at club, because I may not have an event to go to. I've got to try and practice it there, or I'll practice it, there are people I fence at his club, so that's good, too. But I only have one or two foilists up there. His club is more dedicated to épée. I just practice my foil, things he's taught me with whoever I can. It is hard, because you get it and then you have to execute. Your opponent is not your coach. They're not going to be executing – helping you execute. They're helping to – they want to hit you.
[0:25:03] BW: Yes. Yes. When you look back in the history of fencing, there were a lot more two-weapon fencers. it seems more rare these days. I was really struck by the fact that you were able to get a gold medal in two different weapons in April, as we mentioned. I guess, as someone who's not an experienced fencer, my confusion there is how do you keep them straight and make sure you know which tactics you want to apply to which situation, seeing as you've basically doubled the complexity for yourself?
[0:25:37] GL: Well, additionally, I thought that that would be a problem. Frankly, I had really focused on foil throughout my fencing. The first instructor I had was an épéeist, and he showed me a couple things here and there, but I didn't fence any épée. Then what happened is the club, like I say, in Melbourne, they do the épée up there. While he would be instructing, Coach Bucur is instructing his épéeists, I'm listening in the background to what he's talking about. What happened was all of a sudden, I thought, “Oh, wait a minute. This is an interesting game.”
Then I thought, well, you should do épée, just because here in Florida, when I'm fencing, I fence the open events. Now the open events here are tough, because you've got young men, teenagers, college boys. It's a struggle for me sometimes to stay in 16, or even get to eight, just because the competition's very stiff. It's deep. I go to have fun and do my best, whatever, but the problem was with my B rating, I could only do the open. I had nothing else to do. I'm driving three and a half hours to fence an event and then I'm done. I thought, “You know what, I need to do some épée. Why not?”
I was doing a little saber, but I don't have anybody to practice. That’s just strictly for fun. I thought, I should do épée. Just before COVID shut everything down, I did an event in Tampa. I did my – I thought I'd take my épée and I'll go fence. It was a good day, because I think I earned my E that day. It was pretty good. Then I was set to do, I thought, “You know what? I'll do épée at NAC. Why not?” It's a good warm up for foil. That’s basically how I did it. I don't take any épée lessons. I just decided to do it.
What happened was the COVID happened, so no épée for me at NAC. The first event I think I had was right when we started fencing again. I think I only did one event. Then last season I did all the events and basically, I did them as a warm up for foil, because I looked at it this way. I'm fencing. I'm on the strip. I'm using distance and tactics. Yes, it's a little bit different because of no right of way. You don't want to get hit. I began to really enjoy the chess game. I really, really like the mental game of épée. I love it.
It's not hard to keep it separate, because I have to think differently, both of them. You think differently, yet you think the same. It's a confusing answer, but I figured, well, the épée should help my foil, because you got to parry. You don't want to get hit. Like I say, I just did it because it was – I don't want to dismiss it, because I really like it and was surprised that I did well enough in it. It surprised me. I finished 2022, the last season, I believe seventh in the field all around. I was pretty happy with that.
It's not a problem keeping it straight. I thought I'd have a problem with it, but I don't. I know that they really would like you to focus on one weapon if you really want to excel. I know it's extremely difficult for anybody to have great success in both weapons, because you really have to focus on even at a world level, you don't see that.
[0:28:42] BW: Yeah. One thing I love about fencing is that the benefits extend beyond fencing, right? Beyond tournament results. I'm curious if you've seen ways that fencing has affected your life in positive ways outside of the competition and the physical aspects.
[0:28:59] GL: It has for a lot. The club satisfaction aside, I would say for me, it's helped me feel more confident about things I do. It gives you a nice feeling of accomplishment, just that carries in through your life that you feel like you can just carry yourself better and just do what you set out to do, because the hard work here pays off. You learn that it's the same as life. If you put the work in, hopefully, things work out, but you have to be able to accept it when it doesn't work out. I think that's what fencing teaches the kids, too. This is life. You can work hard and have everything go your way, but then at the end, it doesn't.
You have to learn to be humble about it and learn to accept the challenges better. It's made me patient. Three things in life have made me patient; breaking horses, fencing and painting. There's no rush. You cannot hurry any of this up, and I'm not a patient person. Everybody wants results now and that's me. I want it extra now. It has helped me calm down a little bit and realize that some days you have a bad practice. You can't hang on to bad things. You have to let it go and you can't really hang on to the good things that much either. You have to remember them as good moments.
However, I do feel that fencing also teaches you. It's a, whatever you've done for me today sport. Because whatever you've done in the past, even if it was three weeks ago, well, that's great. Well, what about the next time? There's that constant renewal of what you need to do, but I think it has just shown me that things can be accomplished where that's not always been easy for me to believe.
[0:30:31] BW: Something like painting, you can show your friends who don't paint, “This is what I've been up to,” and they can say, “Okay, I understand that.” Fencing, how do you explain to your non-fencing friends your passion for the sport and the fact that you're out there winning gold medals and do they understand?
[0:30:49] GL: Yes and no. I think a lot of them are surprised, perhaps, maybe that I'm doing it at my age. I said, well, you should see these women. My competitors are fierce and they're all pretty intense, too. That's not unusual. I think that it's hard, because for example, I might tell one of my friends, “I'm going for my lessons,” and they say, “You're still taking lessons?” I said, “Yeah. You're always taking lessons, because it's –” you know that old joke about, by the time you learn everything about fencing, you're too old to do it, because there's just so much and you're constantly – I find every single time I go for a lesson with my coach, I come away with some new bit of information. Every single time. I have never gone up there and not come away going, “Well, that was worth the drive. I learned something new today.”
It's funny, because people might want to come watch. It's like, when non-fencers come, “Oh, I want to come see you bout.” They do it once. Everybody's got their poison and that's fine with me. It's okay if they don't understand. Everybody's got their passion with whatever it is. I don't understand football. They don't understand fencing. I do wish in saying that though, I do wish that the sport got more recognition, because I think that once you understand a sport, it makes it so much more compelling to watch.
I can see the relationships, now that I've learned about strategy and tactics, I can, not that I'll sit through hours and hours of soccer, but I can watch some soccer and say, “Wow, that's like a fencing setup. Look what they're doing.” Or I can watch tennis and say, “Oh, yeah. That's what you do on the strip.” You can relate what's going on. I wish that somehow, the public could see what an exciting sport it is, because it really is. I think it's lack of education. They'll put the Olympics on and they'll show saber. If you ask anybody, did you watch the Olympics? “Oh, yeah. Watch these two guys run at each other and hit.” They have no idea how difficult it is in a right of way sport and especially with the speed of saber, for example, to get that touch, or that parry repost.
There's as much excitement in an épée. I just watched some of the women fence at the most recent World Cup. It's so exciting, but people just don't know. I think it's too bad. I don't know how that can change.
[0:32:56] BW: No, I hear you for sure. That's also a pathway to get more people at all ages, but also more vet fencers involved. People trying it for the first time in their 40s, like you did.
[0:33:06] GL: Right.
[0:33:08] BW: George, as we wrap up here, what's next for you? We've got the Vet World is coming up in Daytona in October. What are some of your goals for your fencing for the rest of the year and beyond?
[0:33:19] GL: Well, I would just like to keep on doing what I'm doing. Every about is its own bout. I've got to focus on each bout one touch at a time, which is what I had to do fencing Jeanette. She's a formidable opponent in that final. Everything's one touch at a time. Everything you do is one touch at a time. I would just like to carry on here. I hope to do well at the worlds. I'm very, very excited that I qualified in both Foil and épée. I'm thrilled about that. It boggles the mind, because I never in a million years what I have imagined. I used to joke with my first instructor about, I couldn't remember a parry four to a parry six from one week to the next. I'd say, “Well, whatever happens.” Every two years, I get a pair of repos. I don't know.
Then to find myself here, I'm thrilled. I'm humbled. I'm excited. Support from my husband, putting up with my long hours away, running club, taking lessons, all these. I just want to carry on and do it while I'm able to. I'm looking to fence again next year and just try to keep doing these as well as I can do, and prove how fun, no matter what it brings and enjoy the sport as much as I can.
I'll have to say, that it has been – fencing has made the last 20 years of my life, even when I didn't know what I was doing, it has been – I don't know what my life would be without it. I really don't. Even a bad day, I still love it. When I lost in Croatia and my first elimination, I sat down and I thought, who can I sell all this to? If somebody had said to me, “Oh, the NAC deadline’s tomorrow. You better sign up.” I would have said, “I'm not going.” But you have to shake it off. I was despondent. I was ready to go. I felt good and I lost. It was just one of those days.
Then it happens to everybody. It happens to everybody. It's okay. You shake it off and the next day, you calm down and you watch everybody else and you cheer for it. We had some good Florida results at the world and you cheer for the other people and you carry on. That's all I want to do. I just want to carry on and have a good time and challenge my opponents and challenge my opponents more and more and just keep going.
[0:35:23] BW: This time, we should say it's on home soil and really close to home soil for –
[0:35:27] GL: It's very. It's two hours.
[0:35:28] BW: - for you. That's going to be great. Daytona Beach, for those who don't know is the site of this year's FIE Veteran World. What a great time for you to have qualified in two weapons.
[0:35:38] GL: Well, it's true. A part of it is, of course, I love to travel. I like to go overseas with it all. On the other hand, it's going to be nice not to have to drag an épée and Foil across the pond. I can only have to drive it up a couple of hours. That part's going to be nice. I'm looking forward to a good turnout with it. It'll be exciting to have everybody here. I've scheduled my work time off. I'm happy about that. It's going to be great.
[0:36:01] BW: Those friends who maybe don't quite understand what you're doing, “Well, come watch me,” right? “Come watch me against the world's best.”
[0:36:06] GL: Exactly. They may. Well, we keep saying, all those people who say they want to come and watch, well, here's your chance. Let's see. I don't expect, because it'll be four event. I hope four events. I don't know. It'll be individual-team, individual-team. It's ultimately four events. We'll see how it goes. Hopefully, I can be fencing in two of them. It'd be nice if I can fence in more of them. We'll see how it shakes out. I'll just keep working hard.
[0:36:31] BW: We'll be there to cheer you on from all of us at USA Fencing. Well, I just want to say thanks so much, George, for joining us on the podcast. This has been a great conversation and getting to hear some of your story.
[0:36:40] GL: Thank you.
[0:36:41] BW: We'll be rooting you on this season and beyond.
[0:36:43] GL: Great, great. All right. Thank you so much for your time.
[0:36:46] BW: Thanks.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[0:36:48] BW: Thanks for listening to First of 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing. We'll be back with our next conversation in a couple of weeks. In the meantime, you can stay up to date on all the latest fencing news by following us on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter. If you like this podcast, please help us grow and reach more people by leaving us a rating, or review. Until next time, I'm Bryan Wendell, and I hope to see you real soon out on the strip. Bye.
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