Our guest is Anne Cebula, an epee fencer who has qualified for the Olympic Games Paris 2024. Anne's journey from first watching fencing at the 2008 Olympics in Beijing to becoming a national champion and now an Olympian in the sport is nothing short of inspirational. She's navigated the competitive landscape of fencing with grace, strategy and an unwavering love for the sport.
Our guest is Anne Cebula, an epee fencer who has recently qualified for the Olympic Games Paris 2024.
Anne's journey from first watching fencing at the 2008 Olympics in Beijing to becoming a national champion and now an Olympian in the sport is nothing short of inspirational.
She's navigated the competitive landscape of fencing with grace, strategy and an unwavering love for the sport.
[00:00:01] BW: Hello, and welcome to First to 15, the official podcast of USA fencing. I'm your host, Bryan Wendell. And in this show, you're going to hear from some of the most inspiring, interesting, and insanely talented people in this sport we all love.
First to 15 is for anyone in the fencing community and even for those just checking out fencing to see what it's all about. Whether you're an Olympian, or Paralympian, a newcomer, a seasoned veteran, a fencing parent, a fan, or anyone else in this wonderful community, this podcast is for you. With that, let's get to today's episode. Enjoy.
[INTERVIEW]
[00:00:40] BW: Today we are recording live at the April NAC and Division 1 National Championships. And we have Anne Cebula who is an épée fencer and recently qualified for the Olympic Games in Paris 2024.
Anne's journey from first watching fencing in 2008 when the Olympics were going on in Beijing, to becoming a national champion, and now an Olympian is really inspiring. You've navigated the complex landscape of fencing with grace, and strategy, and a love of the sport. We're super excited to have you here. Welcome, Anne.
[00:01:09] AC: Thank you. Thank you for having me.
[00:01:11] BW: I'm excited to talk to you today. And I guess we should start with the biggest news, which is that you've qualified for the Olympics, which is so awesome. I think you were in China when you got locked in, right? The math was such that you were guaranteed one of those top three spots. Do you remember who told you the news and how you first reacted?
[00:01:30] AC: Yeah. Actually, the tournament before China, it was Budapest. And right before Budapest, I was just kind of like at a low point in the season and I stopped looking at the points. Because I took a peek. My thing is always like don't look at the points. And I took a peek. Because I was just – again, just a low point. It really was like a surprise.
I got eliminated in my first DE in China. And I like go back to my stuff. And I'm getting a phone call from Sergey, my coach, and he's like, "How did it go?" And I was like, "Oh, I'm a little pissed off. I went in too hot-headed with my opponent. It's someone that could have gone either way and I feel like I squished the bout too early." And he's kind of quiet for a while, like a minute or two. And I was like, "Oh, gosh. Did I say something wrong?" Maybe I shouldn't have said I'm pissed or something. I should have been more formal. And he was like, "You know, you realize you made it, right?" I was like, "What?" And it's disbelief.
It's pretty funny. Because, in fencing specifically, our qualification period is that it's like a period. It's not just like one or two Olympic trials. It's a whole year. There's no like ticker tape, or confetti, or, "I made it to Paris," when you qualify. It's just kind of like pat on the back.
[00:02:43] BW: It could be a tournament where you don't necessarily do the best. But just that happens to be the point when you cross that threshold. Right?
[00:02:49] AC: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:02:50] BW: Yeah. That is interesting. Who was your next phone call or text to? Did you immediately start calling family and friends?
[00:02:56] AC: Well, the first thing, I texted my parents and they're kind of like, "What?" Groggy. Because a 12-hour difference. I was like, "Okay. Before I call my parents, let me 100% confirm with Natalie," our head coach. And I pull Natalie aside. She just was doing a lesson with one of my other teammates and she's like, "Wait. Wait. Wait. Are you okay?" And I was like, "Am I locked in? Am I going?" And she's like, "Yeah. You didn't know?" I was like, "No. I didn't know. I stopped looking at the points." And she's like showing me. And I just start – that's when I really just start bawling my eyes out. Because before it was just shock.
And then I called my parents. And my parents didn't believe anything until it was posted on Instagram. Believe it or not, they're, "This is not official yet." I was just like, "I swear they're going to post it in a few days." And they're like –
[00:03:41] BW: Because I think we waited until the following Wednesday to post. Yeah. And so, then it's official once they see it with their own eyes.
[00:03:48] AC: Literally.
[00:03:48] BW: That's funny. How would you characterize that Olympic qualification period for you? You said that there were some ups and downs. Obviously, we know the result you're going. But what was the whole period like for you?
[00:04:01] AC: It's funny because I was never really a favorite going into the beginning of the quad. And it wasn't even a quad. This cycle was like a triad.
[00:04:09] BW: We need a new word for it, right? Yeah.
[00:04:11] AC: Exactly. But I kind of just stuck to my plan. Because Michael Aufrichtig, Columbia fencing coach, chairman of fencing at New York Athletic Club, he was like, "We're going to work with you. But I need your plan. What is your three-year plan?" And I said, "Listen, I'm ranked 8th." I think it was even 9th. At one point I was even 12th in the beginning of the triad. But I was like, "I'm going to peek when it matters. I'm going to peek at the right moment. Just trust me. Here's my plan." He was like, "All right. Let's go. Let's go all-in."
I remember that first tournament was Cali, a year ago today. And it's such an abrupt beginning to the qualification period. Because at the end of a year, yeah, it's not like – you'd think it starts September or something.
[00:04:51] BW: It doesn't line up with the season really. Yeah.
[00:04:53] AC: Calendar year. Yeah. It's a little odd. But I remember the night before Cali, I was, "Tike this is it. It's game time. Let's go." And that's such a simple thing. But I told myself I wanted to do well early. Because I was like, "This is épée. Crazy things have happened." And crazy things did happen during this season. We've had some historic results. And kudos to my teammates. But it's disorienting. It's anxiety-inducing. And you have to be ready for that going into this process. Am I prepared to give it my all and be okay with either outcome? And so, that's how the season went.
[00:05:26] BW: That's a great point. Because they say that about a baseball season, which is also super long, right? That a win in game one is worth as much as a win in game 162. And the Olympic qualification cycle is the same way. Because the points you earn in that very first tournament mattered just as much as the ones that if you had needed to fence here at the April NAC, they would have mattered just as much, which is super fascinating.
The math behind it all, you said you weren't checking at that specific point. But how do you not just drive yourself crazy throughout the season being like, "Okay, I'm in second. I'm in first. I'm in third." How do you just not make that your sole focus?
[00:06:04] AC: Well, I did crack a little bit when I'd say the beginning. I did. I made a really great like first result. Fell off at the next World Cup. But then at Worlds, I punched in another result and I was like, "Okay, this is what I need to do." Et cetera. Et cetera. But my opponents were studying me because they were like, "What is going on? Who is this chick that made top 16 twice? We got to watch out for these Americans."
And noticed that people were fencing me differently. They were using certain actions that I was uncomfortable with. And so, it was kind of dealing with the pressure of suddenly being studied more than I ever had in my life. And, also, the pressure of the road is still so long. There's still a whole half year ahead. It's only been three or four tournaments. That was tough.
And I actually had to talk to a sports psychologist because I was so frazzled. I was showing up to these tournaments thinking to myself, "I made these top results early. I'm scared about people catching up. I'm scared about people catching up." When your mentality should be the other way around. You should aim to be – who's in front of you? I want to be the best. I want to be the best. I want to be first.
[00:07:09] BW: And be flattered that people are studying you. Because that's a sign that you're a threat, right? In a good way.
[00:07:14] AC: Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. I think, yeah, just flipping that mentality. I really needed that meeting with the psychologist to like take it there. Because I became complacent. Because I was like, "Oh, two top 16s." Historically, who's going to catch up to me well? Some people will, you know?
[00:07:32] BW: And anything can happen, right? Especially in épée, like you said. The sports psychologist, I think that's super brave and super wise. Because I think, probably in our sport, that's an underrated side of being a champion is the mental game. If you're willing to share like what was that experience like for you and there's I think the people listening who maybe have been debating, making that move themselves, might wonder what'd you get out of it?
[00:07:58] AC: Yeah. It was really eye-opening. First of all, it was like connected through the USOPC. And it was virtual. And what's great is like it was covered because we have like a certain amount of athletes that can use the services. It was really nice because the psychologist herself was also an athlete in individual skiing. She completely spoke the language. The whole dynamic of like training as an individual. But, also, preparing for a semi-team event. And constantly comparing yourself to others.
And I think the most helpful thing with a psychologist is, one, they're really great at reframing things. But, secondly, they're someone that you could just dump on to and they know how to handle that information. Because sometimes you can't do that to say friends or family back home or even your coach. They serve a different purpose. You don't tell your PT problems that you have with your mental game on this trip. Everyone has a purpose. And that's what the sports psychologist comes in for.
[00:08:52] BW: I think that's awesome. Can we go back to the beginning? And we alluded to this a little bit in the introduction. But the story, and tell me if I have this, right is that when you were 10, you were watching the Olympics, which were in Beijing in 2008. And that's when you first kind of were like, "What's this fencing all about?" And you even said it's like watching an opera. What do you remember about that first exposure to fencing?
[00:09:13] AC: It's funny. Because over the past two, three months, I'm being asked to recall this story. And I'm realizing, my mom, one day, she's like, "You should look up." I think that bout was Keeth Smart's bout against Russia. And the team – I was like, "You know what?" I watched the clip. I was like, "This is literally –" it was like such a crazy blast to the past. And that bout specifically. And, also, just fencing. First of all, it's such a beautiful sport. Aesthetically pleasing. And all this athleticism.
But there's so much emotion involved. And I say the opera, the theatrics. Because you only see that in most sports at the end, the end result when they cross the finish line and they finish that final lap at the pool. In fencing, it's after every touch, especially in saber, in a team event.
I was like, "I want to do that. And I want to do that there, on that stage, with the Rings and everything. That's insane." That's what really captivated me. And I hope more kids see that. I feel like that's why Olympics visibility is so important. Because if not fencing, then you'll find another sport that gets that stage light.
[00:10:18] BW: That was when you first saw fencing. And then you first actually tried it in high school. What was that like? Not every high school has fencing, first of all. That was fortunate that yours did. What made you want to say, "Okay, this is more than just a spectator sport for me?"
[00:10:33] AC: Yeah. The high school club was kind of relaxed. The coach didn't open the equipment closet until May. Because you tell kids, a bunch of teenagers, "Swords. Wwords club. He's not going to –" he weeded a lot of kids out. Because all we did was footwork. Footwork. Footwork. Footwork. And running up and down flights of stairs. It's like an eight-story school. There were maybe 10 kids left out of a group of 50.
[00:11:01] BW: Oh, my gosh.
[00:11:02] AC: And it was funny. At the end of it, he was like, "All right. Yes. Here's the equipment. But if you want to take this to the next level –" he just kind of opened the door and he was like, "You need to look up fencing clubs in the city, and bite the bullet, and pay for a one-week camp somewhere, and just try it out. Because this is the best that I could do for you guys with the resources that I have. Go forth." We were like, "Okay. Got it, coach."
And so, I did a week-long camp at Fencer's Club, which was more of like a day camp. I mean, the first half of the camp was like chess. The second half was fencing. But it was a mixed group. It wasn't like a super competitive situation. But there was a competition at the end of the camp that I took super seriously.
I remember in my head, I was like, "This is my moment. I got to show that – I've been waiting to do this for so long." And Kornel Udvarhelyi, he's since semi-retired. He moved to Boston. He has a club there. Or Massachusetts. And he told my parents, he's like, "Hey, this girl has potential. She's good aim. And I really like that she's fired up. I like her spirit." And so it kind of went on from there. Yeah.
[00:12:05] BW: And the footwork that you had been developing for so long paid off, I hope, right?
[00:12:10] AC: Yeah. In a school cafeteria.
[00:12:12] BW: Oh, my gosh. That is awesome. You were also the team captain in high school, right? The leadership skills that you developed there, have you felt like those have carried with you through college and now fencing on the team for Team USA?
[00:12:28] AC: Yeah. In high school, yes, everyone is on a fencing team because they want a fence. But what everyone wants to do with that fencing beyond high school is different. Different individuals have different plans with the thing that they signed up for.
And so, I translate those skills into whenever I was in a group project saying college. I'd be in a class and, yes, we had a group project. But I knew one kid was taking the class because it's a requirement. A part of the core. And so, realizing that and being cognizant of everyone has individual lives. It's not just like drop everything for this one cause has been really important. Whenever I'm in a leadership position, that's something that I've always kept in mind.
[00:13:08] BW: And you've carried that with you. That's awesome. And then did your approach to sport change when you got to college at Columbia Barnard College, right? How did your approach change?
[00:13:19] AC: When I got to Barnard/Columbia, I just went all-in. I was just like eat, sleep, fence, class. There was nothing. My social life was just at the fencing team. I was a transfer. I transferred second half of my sophomore year. I was just like, "I wanted this for so long. I'm going to do 100% that." I was just in between the gym and that.
And so, it was kind of freeing because I didn't have to do a lot of thinking in terms of training. It was just kind of like going from Fencer's Club down the city, commuting back to Columbia, et cetera, et cetera. And in college, you have your schedule for you.
[00:13:55] BW: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:13:56] AC: When I knew I was going to train for like the next Olympics, and having that conversation with Michael, him asking me for my four/three-year plan, that was very different. And, also, connecting with Sergey, which we had a chance encounter, which was interesting. I was coachless for a little bit when Kornel semi-retired. And Sergey just walked into my pools at like the Budapest Grand Prix. He was coaching the men. But he just walked in and he realized I didn't have a coach. And that was one of the best results that I had.
[00:14:27] BW: Interesting. He was your temporary coach for that tournament.
[00:14:30] AC: Exactly.
[00:14:31] BW: I didn't know that. Okay. And now look at you two. That's crazy.
[00:14:36] AC: Exactly. And what I loved is he's so professional. He had the same idea as Michael. Not so much in like – well, yeah, with a three-year plan. But he was kind of like one step at a time. What's your plan for this week? Week by week, he's checking in. We're doing video review. He's asking about my fitness. He is top-notch, top-level. And, yeah, really instrumental part of the process.
[00:14:55] BW: Which is great. Because when you said three-year plan, I was like, "I don't often have a three-day plan." Having like a three-year plan, it seems kind of daunting. But it sounds like you broke it up into smaller chunks to be able to tackle it step-by-step.
Let's go back though to Barnard to 2019. You won the NCAA Championship, right? And that was obviously special for a number of reasons. But, also, you were the first individual champion at the school. Is that right? In any sport, which is crazy. What was the reception like after you won that title and kind of made history for a whole school?
[00:15:32] AC: It was interesting. Because, I mean, Barnard, Columbia Athletics, it's like interconnected.
[00:15:38] BW: They fence as one team in a way, right?
[00:15:40] AC: Exactly. Yeah. But the percentage that makes up, say, Barnard-specific students is still small. It was kind of nice. Because I'd step over to the other side of the campus where most of the athletes are. I'd walk into the fencing room, everyone's like, "Hey. You did it. Congrats." All this kumbaya. And then I'd cross back the street, back to my home campus, and it was just like another day in the life.
[00:16:03] BW: They were like, "Oh, there was a tournament?"
[00:16:04] AC: Yeah. They're like, "Oh, congrats. Now back to class." It was nice. It was refreshing. Barnard was supportive. But at the same time, I was just like, "Okay. Great." Well, that's what – I don't want to say was expected of me. But everyone there is doing such great things. All my classmates were super inspiring doing crazy things.
I mean, I had a TA who was a year younger than me in Orgo who went to like Harvard Med School. That's the kind of people at your senior day. They're like, "Oh, you won NCAAs? Okay. I mean, you're stumbling in here with your fencing bag every week. We hope you're doing something with it."
[00:16:37] BW: It's nice to have that validation though. You can be like, "Yeah. I have been working hard. And here's the trophy that proves it." That's awesome. We talked a little bit about your coaches. And let's talk a little bit more about Sergey and your coaches. How have they helped you grow let's say from when you first made that three-year plan to today sitting here in April with three months to go before Paris?
[00:16:59] AC: Yeah. Oh, man. Sergey has been like so many things at once. Well, I guess it first started as like my high school coach opening the door. Being like, "Okay, here you go. Go seek a club." And then Kornel being the foundation of my fencing. I've had him for – oh, my gosh. I don't know how many years. Maybe six, seven years-ish? A while. Basically, until Covid. Or after the games. After Tokyo games.
And what was important with him is he built the foundation of my fencing. Built in all this muscle memory, fencing, Hungarian school-ish. All his students are different though. It's crazy. But anyways, he let me play in fencing. He let figured things out in open bouting. He knew I couldn't take lessons that often because we couldn't really afford it at the time. I was taking a lesson maybe once a week at times because school would get crazy like once every two weeks. And so, he knew I was really learning on the job, if you will, at open bouting. And he wouldn't try to correct any weirdness that I would adopt. And he kind of leaned into it. He's like, "I noticed that you do X, Y, Z. Let's build on that."
[00:18:08] BW: Not stop doing that.
[00:18:08] AC: Yeah. Exactly. He was super important in that, the first phase. And then the second phase, the three-year plan, going to the Olympics. I think that's like really fate and like really great that Sergey came into my life when he did. Because he was absolutely necessary. That's what I needed, that extra push, to get me to Paris. Again, super professional. He's like, "Okay, I like what you've been doing. But we got to step it up. You're entering a different circuit now. Senior circuit is very different and the preparations that go behind it."
[00:18:40] BW: Don't change. Just kind of turn the volume up a little bit.
[00:18:43] AC: That's exactly what – he's like, "I love what –" he has immense respect for Kornel. He's like, "I love what Kornel did with you. And I'm honored." He got Kornel's blessing, which was really sweet. Yeah. And he was like, "We're going to work with you. We're going to develop you further." Yeah.
[00:18:58] BW: And, obviously, it's worked out. Can we talk about New York City and the fencing there? Because when it comes to American épée and saber, New York is is like the hot bed for it. What has that done for you being in that environment where you can do that open bouting against other high-level fencers like yourself?
[00:19:17] AC: Oh, my gosh. It absolutely helps with expediting – my expedited journey, I think a huge chunk of it was because of this open bouting in New York City. You have exposure to fencers of all ages, all levels. And, again, you're learning on the job. And it's even down to – if you go to any school in New York City, it doesn't have to be Columbia. St. John's, NYU. Even in the tri-state area. Throw in some jersey schools. If you're commuting into the city. Your fencing is not only going to be preserved in college or developed further in high school. It's going to be developed further, say, in college. Because it's insane. I don't know how else to describe it.
[00:19:57] BW: It allows you to continue building your skills. Yeah. That's really interesting. Academics. Neuroscience and behavior, right? Is there any tie into fencing there? And if it's too much of a stretch, then say so. But do you connect those kind of psychological strategies or principles into your fencing?
[00:20:13] AC: There's definitely – my major was super specialized. We were doing mostly like animal behavior things and like parts of the brain connecting to this. It wouldn't be super micro-level things. But there were some macro-level concepts. And one that like looking back that I'm like, "Wow. This is a crazy connection," is the former President of Barnard, Sian Beilock. Now she's like the president at Dartmouth. Just jumping from a great place to another place.
She wrote a book called Choke. And it's about why successful people at the top of their game choke. What's the science behind it? And how do you prevent it? Et cetera. Et cetera. And one of the things that she mentioned was writing out all your thoughts. Good and bad. Throwing up on the paper, if you will, before your performance helps immensely. And that's something that I've been doing religiously going into this cycle. Or this past year. The first Cali, I sat with a journal before and after my tournament doing that. And I wish I did that earlier. It sounds crazy science. But it is science. And it really has helped. If that's one thing people can take away.
[00:21:21] BW: Yeah. Are you continuing that to this day?
[00:21:23] AC: Yes.
[00:21:23] BW: Wow. Okay. That journal's been filled up with a lot of –
[00:21:26] AC: I have two journals now. I started with one. In the middle of the second one.
[00:21:30] BW: That's great to hear. I think that's really smart. In addition to all of that, you're training for the Olympics as an athlete. You're also a professional model. How do you balance the demands of all that and, frankly, have time in the 24 hours a day and seven days a week?
[00:21:47] AC: The modeling, I put on pause this year. I told my agents, I was like, "I got to go into a cave and like shadow box. If that's okay?" And they're like, "You do your thing." That's great. That helps a lot. Because my agency is like very understanding. My agents are always like fencing first, which I know some people might not have those circumstances, et cetera.
But I knew the year before, Olympic qualification, I could like mess around bit. It was actually helpful traveling with modeling. I'd be in London for like a month. And maybe the fencing wasn't the strongest. But like being in that environment and getting used to the time change. And even just being exposed to different fencers who have different priorities and like different styles. That was super helpful.
[00:22:29] BW: You'd continue training even when you were in another city for modeling.
[00:22:31] AC: Yes.
[00:22:32] BW: That's cool. You're bringing your fencing bag with you everywhere.
[00:22:35] AC: Yes. I was running from castings. They're like, "What are you doing? Why do you have like fresh bruises on your arms?" I'm like, "Please. It's nothing suspicious. I'm fencing." That was super fun.
And then another thing that I think translates with like modeling, and like fencing, and I guess school, is you always have to be on. And so, say things didn't go well in modeling. Say, a casting didn't go well. I'd be like, "Okay. Well, that was beyond me." And it was easy to carry that energy. It was almost enlightening. I'm not really sure the word. But it was uplifting to take that energy into fencing later on that evening and be like, "Well, this, I do have control over. This, I can put an A and get B."
[00:23:15] BW: Yeah. Yeah. And you're totally in control of the results there instead of a third-party. Especially in épée, right? There's no ref – well, there's a referee. But it's in your hands, right? The bout is in your hands. As Paris approaches and looking ahead, how are the next three months going to unfold for you?
[00:23:32] AC: Number one priority, super underrated, is just staying healthy. Staying healthy. But, also, balancing that line with trying to peek at the right moment again. It's all about these peeks.
[00:23:43] BW: And you got more tournaments too, right? It makes it difficult. It's not just straight training.
[00:23:48] AC: No. Yeah. And using those tournaments to my advantage. How can I scope out more information for my opponents? But, also, using them as training in terms of simplicity of conditioning and just being in a tournament environment. Because that's really hard to replicate back home.
[00:24:04] BW: True. True. Yeah. You've already given us some good advice for younger fencers. I love the journaling thing and just putting it all out there after a tournament. I also want to read something you said before senior worlds that you told us as one of your things of advice. And it kind of ties into something we've already talked about today, which is, "Communicate with your coach your plans for the week, for the season, for the next five years. Don't be shy or play down your goals. Your coaches are there to help you and guide you through the process." Can we talk about like what you meant about don't be shy? Because a lot of younger fencers might have Olympic aspirations or making a senior team but maybe they don't want to admit that. Is that what you kind of meant by that? If you could explain that a little bit.
[00:24:44] AC: 100%, that's exactly what it is. It's scary to put that out there. Because when you first dream of those things, they seem ridiculous. Because you're like, "I'm a C-rated fencer. And I want to go to –" oh, God. What's like 2028? 2032 or something. And it's like, well, it's not embarrassing to say that. Or don't be scared to say that. Say that to your coach. And your coach can be – your coach is there to break it down to more realistic pieces. Because that could be daunting. You could go to Iraq the next week and get knocked down the first round. You're like, "Well, there goes 2032." And it's like, "No. You got to –"
[00:25:18] BW: It doesn't work like that.
[00:25:20] AC: Exactly. That's what coaches are there for. And coaches are always secretly very excited when they get students that are already thinking so far ahead. Or even if the goal isn't that. Even if the goal is just – and I say just lightly. I mean, sarcastically. To get into D1 school. I want to be on the team. I want to be on the roster. That's a lofty goal too. Let's break it down. Let's work on it. And I think it's important to do that.
And I found that out because, in New York, the clubs are so large. You could kind of get lost in the mix. It's important to speak up, especially if you're in a club that's huge or you feel like you're getting a little bit lost in there.
[00:25:58] BW: Yeah. It kind of helps you stand out and differentiate yourself in your coach's mind, I would imagine. Finally, as you reflect on where you've come from so far, what are you most proud of? I mean, obviously, qualifying for the Olympics. But big picture, what are you most proud of?
[00:26:13] AC: I think doing the most that I could with the resources that I had at the time. I feel like – and, also, just never looking behind. I feel like if I ever looked behind or like walking on a tightrope, if I ever looked below me, I would have panicked.
Going into NCAAs. If I knew no one had won woman's épée for Columbia before, I don't think I would have won it, you know? Or going into Paris. If I had known, "Oh, man. It's only three years instead of four." It's better to just full steam ahead. Don't look back. Yeah, that's like a whole combination of advice. But just do what you love. It's possible – let me see. I'm mixing in so many different things at once.
[00:26:55] BW: No. I think it makes perfect sense. And there's so many experiences that you've had that have kind of all combined together to get you here. But at the same time, you shouldn't be just constantly looking back at them. Right? And keep focusing on that goal, which for you is Paris. And it's coming up in a few months.
Thank you so much for taking some time. This has been a great conversation. And we'll be cheering you on in the months to come.
[00:27:19] AC: Yay.
[00:27:19] BW: Anne Cebula, thank you so much.
[00:27:20] AC: Thank you so much, Bryan.
[OUTRO]
[00:27:23] BW: Thanks for listening to First to 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing. We'll be back with our next conversation in a couple of weeks. In the meantime, you can stay up-to-date on all the latest fencing news by following us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. And if you like this podcast, please help us grow and reach more people by leaving us a rating or a review. Until next time, I'm Bryan Wendell. And I hope to see you real soon out on the strip. Bye.
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